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Author	Topic: "Braking bad" - There may be another reason behind sudden ac	Post a Reply Back to Topics

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LetemEatCake Champion Author Oklahoma City Posts:2,800 Points:439,295 Joined:Mar 2008	Message Posted: Mar 13, 2010 9:57:07 PM Ignore LetemEatCake Report Abuse Houckster from Atlanta... Excellent, and thoughful comments. But you forgot one thing.....Gas_buzzer has forgotten the President's name! Must be a case of early onset Alzheimers or something a kin to it!
Houckster Champion Author Atlanta Posts:6,534 Points:631,605 Joined:Sep 2003	Message Posted: Mar 13, 2010 7:38:39 AM Ignore Houckster Report Abuse GAS_BUZZER writes: Obammie, we are tired if the "Nanny State" BS!!! Stick it where the sun does not shine! ____ Is there no end to this brain-dead drivel? GASBUZZER, please grow up. ** As pointed out in the article, the "smart pedal" will be useful. First, because there may very well be a defect in the electronics that does cause unintended acceleration, we should have this new "smart pedal" just as with the the Audi problem where the first "smart pedal" was introduced and which is universal now. These problems simply illustrate a larger need. One of the primary things that the automotive electronics must be able to do better is to prevent contradictory events such as acceleration and braking inputs at the same time. Another thing that vehicles need for safety is proximity sensors that would permit the electronics to override inputs that would lead to an accident. For example, a person in stop'n'go traffic who accidently presses the accelerator when just off the bumper of the car in front. But the value of programming cars to avoid contradictory inputs goes further. If this programming had been part of the electronics, this problem would have likely been caught before the cars that Toyota has recalled ever reached the road. And even if it hadn't been caught prior to selling the cars, the software could have revealed that such an event had occurred providing far more effective feedback than what Toyota has to work with now. Done right modern electronics and the programming that operates it have a huge potential for making travel safer. Done wrong, and cars can be less safe. The Obama administration's proposal is a step in the right direction but not a big enough one. [Edited by: Houckster at 3/13/2010 8:40:13 AM EST]**
1006 Veteran Author Birmingham Posts:305 Points:614,960 Joined:Apr 2008	Message Posted: Mar 13, 2010 6:49:55 AM Ignore 1006 Report Abuse this is editorial - let's get back to 'gas news'
honda0105 Champion Author Tallahassee Posts:10,793 Points:633,350 Joined:Nov 2008	Message Posted: Mar 12, 2010 8:47:38 PM Ignore honda0105 Report Abuse the problem is that everyone is whining about Toyota, that's the problem when you're #1. Considering how many Toyotas are currently on the road, I don't think it's near as big an issue as the media makes it out to be. But then they would not sell papers if they didn't smear someone's reputation ...
Gas_Buzzer Champion Author South Carolina Posts:9,493 Points:1,705,010 Joined:Sep 2005	Message Posted: Mar 12, 2010 5:48:12 AM Ignore Gas_Buzzer Report Abuse Obammie, we are tired if the "Nanny State" BS!!! Stick it where the sun does not shine!
MyVue08 Champion Author Columbus Posts:3,950 Points:447,935 Joined:May 2009	Message Posted: Mar 12, 2010 1:28:39 AM Ignore MyVue08 Report Abuse Duplicate Article!
NavyStore Champion Author Seattle Posts:2,692 Points:1,188,895 Joined:Aug 2005	Message Posted: Mar 12, 2010 12:07:43 AM Ignore NavyStore Report Abuse I still don't do imports.
FastAndy Champion Author Indianapolis Posts:4,216 Points:1,117,045 Joined:Jun 2007	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 10:59:25 PM Ignore FastAndy Report Abuse If those auto companies can do it then Toyota can do it.
Number43 Champion Author Lexington Posts:3,527 Points:682,125 Joined:Oct 2008	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 10:55:43 PM Ignore Number43 Report Abuse Sounds just the the excuse that the rape victim was asking for it. I saw them Audi's vibrate and shift into gear. It was not driver error. If the car is made right then the factory and their shrill's don't have to make up lies and excuses. Toyota was first on my list for thwe next car but now I will never own one. I forgive mistakes but I don't forgive excuses and lies.
ItsMorph Champion Author Grand Rapids Posts:26,712 Points:2,212,935 Joined:Mar 2004	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 10:52:21 PM Ignore ItsMorph Report Abuse THE Obama administration? Were their questions of others?
toyrunner300 Champion Author Calgary Posts:2,142 Points:1,006,950 Joined:Jan 2007	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 10:47:46 PM Ignore toyrunner300 Report Abuse Where are you going to find them swlincdrv?
jjw0608 Champion Author Milwaukee Posts:3,382 Points:1,002,370 Joined:Nov 2005	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 10:46:53 PM Ignore jjw0608 Report Abuse Whats this;another excuse?
MidNJ Champion Author New Jersey Posts:1,657 Points:252,670 Joined:Sep 2009	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 10:44:44 PM Ignore MidNJ Report Abuse Personally, I only like news that is fair and balanced. So, why does the "Gas Prices" site allow news from the biased New York Times to be posted here?
Skychief Veteran Author Florida Posts:259 Points:182,485 Joined:May 2006	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 10:38:42 PM Ignore Skychief Report Abuse What a dumb idea.
swlincdrv Veteran Author Lincoln Posts:375 Points:219,115 Joined:Oct 2008	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 10:35:11 PM Ignore swlincdrv Report Abuse How about we just have smart drivers.
judgemobile Champion Author Ohio Posts:2,766 Points:1,489,985 Joined:Nov 2005	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 10:31:18 PM Ignore judgemobile Report Abuse O' Bummer learns from Toyoda. The dumb learning from the sneaky.
altima2008 Champion Author Philadelphia Posts:3,259 Points:771,010 Joined:Apr 2008	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 10:28:13 PM Ignore altima2008 Report Abuse The Nobama administration needs to stay out of the auto industry and try and fix the other problems in this economy like getting us fair gas prices, creating jobs stuff like that!
TBRR Champion Author Jacksonville Posts:1,330 Points:234,660 Joined:Dec 2007	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 10:27:40 PM Ignore TBRR Report Abuse too many drivers use their left foot for the brake and their right foot for the gas pedal. if the pedals are close enough you can catch both with one foot or panic and miss the brake and hit the gas which i think happens in most cases but who would admit it. quick solution is to just turn off the car and let it slow down, of course you had better be strong enough to over ride the power steering.
Lukus Champion Author Halifax Posts:3,509 Points:713,240 Joined:Nov 2007	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 10:13:29 PM Ignore Lukus Report Abuse Toyota's problems are probably in software.
DosEquis26 Champion Author Chicago Posts:1,952 Points:1,094,010 Joined:Jun 2006	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 10:07:29 PM Ignore DosEquis26 Report Abuse the New york Times is saying that drivers are idiots. so much for the NY Times.
panama303 All-Star Author Denver Posts:501 Points:200,940 Joined:Jan 2005	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 10:05:00 PM Ignore panama303 Report Abuse hmmm. I cannot buy this theory. I suspect that most drivers know how to hit the correct pedal. Maybe in a panic they would hit the wrong pedal momentarily. If you have owned a car especially the same car for a period of time, you know where the pedals are. And if you were accelerating because your foot was on the gas pedal, your reaction would be to pull it off. Why are we always played for fool? [Edited by: panama303 at 3/11/2010 11:06:02 PM EST]
CrazyQ Champion Author Washington Posts:16,327 Points:2,099,570 Joined:Aug 2004	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 10:03:50 PM Ignore CrazyQ Report Abuse Aw come on. rather than putting more gadgets computer controlled in the car, how about having drivers pay attention. or maybe better quality control in the factories - or computer programmers.
wiwhite87 Champion Author Indiana Posts:1,034 Points:120,835 Joined:May 2009	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 9:58:49 PM Ignore wiwhite87 Report Abuse I don't buy the Toyota cases in majority are due to driver error. This is something fundamentally taking over and applying throttle. The stories of smoking brakes and other attempts to stop the car rule out drivers simply holding the pedal down. Sure, there will be a minority of all makes suffering from driver error, and that's nearly unpreventable. I've had an accelerator stick on an '87, but it was due to a ball & socket at the end of the linkage getting stuck, so odd things do happen, but it wasn't anything where it actually applied throttle beyond what I input.
AtascaderoHound All-Star Author California Posts:557 Points:588,690 Joined:Oct 2006	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 9:58:15 PM Ignore AtascaderoHound Report Abuse I think I can find an accelerator. It's the times when I'm there and a Toyota death machine takes over that has me worried.
beachbumCA Champion Author Riverside Posts:4,069 Points:767,500 Joined:May 2008	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 9:53:48 PM Ignore beachbumCA Report Abuse Lets see, the accelerator is on the right?
Bubba44612 Champion Author Ohio Posts:2,676 Points:918,925 Joined:Aug 2005	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 9:49:20 PM Ignore Bubba44612 Report Abuse Momma always said you can't fix stupid.
MidNJ Champion Author New Jersey Posts:1,657 Points:252,670 Joined:Sep 2009	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 9:47:20 PM Ignore MidNJ Report Abuse A New York Times Editorial? I like fair and balanced news and we all know the New York Times is biased.
zdn Champion Author New Jersey Posts:1,216 Points:318,895 Joined:Sep 2009	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 9:45:03 PM Ignore zdn Report Abuse bad drivers? i knew it
packards42 Champion Author Washington Posts:1,682 Points:306,280 Joined:Feb 2005	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 9:44:24 PM Ignore packards42 Report Abuse This guy will be an expert witness for the defense in the Toyota class action suits. I suspect he right in most of the cases. if not all
mstearno Champion Author Dayton Posts:3,596 Points:798,315 Joined:Jan 2008	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 9:38:51 PM Ignore mstearno Report Abuse I'm sick of theories lets get some proof or put a cutoff switch on the car
hwnguy Champion Author Honolulu Posts:2,981 Points:647,780 Joined:Apr 2008	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 9:37:39 PM Ignore hwnguy Report Abuse Hard to fix human error
ILANGE9 Champion Author Illinois Posts:2,539 Points:624,480 Joined:Sep 2008	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 9:37:33 PM Ignore ILANGE9 Report Abuse Great idea. But I agree that most of sudden acceleration is due to operator error. There area lot of stories about old people running over people claiming their car was out of control and brakes wouldn't work. Only to find out they hit the gas instead of the brake. Smart pedals aren't going to help operator error.
fltdoc Champion Author Oklahoma Posts:3,485 Points:606,890 Joined:Oct 2008	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 9:37:13 PM Ignore fltdoc Report Abuse Perhaps the fix for this is to abandon what we were taught in high school driver's education. That is, we were taught to always use the right foot for both brake and accelerator. This avoided the bad habit of a driver who tended to rest their left foot on the brake, causing the brake lights to stay on, and light pressure on the brakes, with excessive wear and poor fuel mileage. However, if these individuals who may be hitting the accelerator in error, were to begin the habit of only braking with the left foot, they would less likely hit the accelerator with the left foot.
comprof Champion Author Houston Posts:1,794 Points:392,275 Joined:Jul 2009	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 9:32:12 PM Ignore comprof Report Abuse Very good informative article. Good Post.
danreino Champion Author Twin Cities Posts:3,801 Points:678,145 Joined:Mar 2008	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 9:30:37 PM Ignore danreino Report Abuse Finally something rather interesting about the Toyota debacle.
AllGold Veteran Author Lansing Posts:408 Points:710,365 Joined:May 2008	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 9:23:52 PM Ignore AllGold Report Abuse Very interesting background information from someone with first-hand experience.
RockCity Champion Author Denver Posts:2,717 Points:484,845 Joined:Mar 2009	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 9:23:00 PM Ignore RockCity Report Abuse So that's why they call them toys.
Asbury09 Champion Author Iowa Posts:2,392 Points:561,555 Joined:Jan 2009	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 9:15:31 PM Ignore Asbury09 Report Abuse the solution is probably so obvious that we haven't seen it for all the cars
cruisingtx Champion Author San Antonio Posts:1,201 Points:529,445 Joined:Jan 2009	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 9:06:39 PM Ignore cruisingtx Report Abuse Toyota you asked for the the Obama administration, great help they will be!
YLHandyman Champion Author Orange County Posts:4,604 Points:834,545 Joined:Feb 2008	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 9:04:45 PM Ignore YLHandyman Report Abuse Driver error is the number one problem.
ThatHunt Champion Author Dallas Posts:2,620 Points:1,228,655 Joined:Jul 2006	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 9:03:44 PM Ignore ThatHunt Report Abuse Keep up the research
puljujarvi Champion Author Tampa Posts:3,497 Points:704,985 Joined:Sep 2008	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 9:03:41 PM Ignore puljujarvi Report Abuse I was finding the same problem occasionally occur with my Dodge Stratus. After pressing the brake, the engine would start revving up to accelerate. Luckily though my Stratus was standard transmission so my other foot was already on the clutch and the car didn't actually pull forward. And for those that believe it was because my foot was on the wrong pedal? It was NOT! I was just very lucky I did not have an automatic transmission, because in the time it took to check it, release my foot from the brake and tap the accelerator I would have made some dangerous entrances into occupied intersections.
TXGasPriceSpy Champion Author Fort Worth Posts:2,691 Points:505,495 Joined:Sep 2008	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 9:00:06 PM Ignore TXGasPriceSpy Report Abuse Let the investigations continue.
VWC Veteran Author Maryland Posts:378 Points:648,940 Joined:Oct 2004	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 8:49:23 PM Ignore VWC Report Abuse It was because the brake pedal was too closed to the gas pedal, which is not the case with today's Toyotas.
OHMS Champion Author Orange County Posts:8,113 Points:914,610 Joined:May 2005	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 8:48:29 PM Ignore OHMS Report Abuse IF YOU SAY SO; perhaps some smart pedals would work well on the mouths of senators; congressmen/ and BO
cupboy Veteran Author Salt Lake City Posts:271 Points:299,240 Joined:Nov 2005	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 8:45:47 PM Ignore cupboy Report Abuse Those steering locks are really dumb. Does nothing to prevent theft. Just makes the car more dangerous. That "feature" needs to be done away with. Is this a government requirement? I'd bet it is.
rx7racerca All-Star Author Calgary Posts:679 Points:256,500 Joined:Sep 2008	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 8:41:22 PM Ignore rx7racerca Report Abuse If you turn the key off, you'll lock the steering, and you may loose brake boost and of course power steering. Shift to neutral, use the brakes to bring the car to a stop, then turn off the ignition. Even if the throttle is sticking, most cars since the late 90's won't rev past 4000 or so in neutral, and if it does, it will hit a rev limiter or fuel cut at or just past redline, so engine damage is unlikely.
carefrey All-Star Author Orlando Posts:985 Points:221,980 Joined:Sep 2009	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 8:40:20 PM Ignore carefrey Report Abuse I agree my first thought was to shut the car off! That should slow you down!
PissedCanuck Champion Author Toronto Posts:3,832 Points:820,385 Joined:Nov 2006	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 8:39:12 PM Ignore PissedCanuck Report Abuse What happens if the "smart pedals" in these vehicles fail. Instead of having a vehicle suddenly takeoff from you, you now have a vehicle that suddenly grinds to a halt without any warning. Not good if an 18 wheeler is about to ram up your rear end!
leissp Rookie Author Toronto Posts:3 Points:15,235 Joined:Nov 2005	Message Posted: Mar 11, 2010 8:36:53 PM Ignore leissp Report Abuse How about turning the key off! or this just a good way to avoid a speeding ticket?